this post was submitted on 19 Nov 2024
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A Discussion about Biological Sex (theness.com)
submitted 2 days ago by florencia@lemmy.blahaj.zone to c/skeptic@lemmy.world
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Steven Paul Novella (born July 29, 1964) is an American clinical neurologist and associate professor at Yale University School of Medicine. Novella is best known for his involvement in the skeptical movement as a host of The Skeptics' Guide to the Universe podcast and as the president of the New England Skeptical Society. He is a fellow of the Committee for Skeptical Inquiry (CSI).

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[–] atzanteol@sh.itjust.works 3 points 2 days ago (2 children)

I always like Steve's writings - he's about as fair as a person can get.

Some people have a strong psychological identity with an animal archetype, just like some people think they are aliens, or that they were reincarnated. This has literally nothing to do with gender identity and is not the same kind of phenomenon

This argument comes up a lot and I would like to know more about what the differences in these phenomenon are.

[–] florencia@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 2 days ago (1 children)

TLDR: One is identifying as a different gender, one is identifying with a different animal.

It's in the same paragraph you quoted:

First, reports of this phenomenon (called therians) is greatly exaggerated. They are often conflated with other groups (like furries). This is pretty clearly a social and psychological phenomenon, not a neurological trait, and having nothing to do with a system of neurological development (influenced by hormones, for example).

To the best of our knowledge, hormones don't influence the animals you like or identify with.

From another source: https://theconversation.com/what-are-furries-debunking-myths-about-kids-identifying-as-animals-and-litter-boxes-in-schools-193908

Furries don’t identify as animals; they identify with animals. In the same way that cosplayers typically don’t believe they are actually Spiderman, furries don’t think they are their fursonas.

Is furry an orientation? It’s not. It’s a fandom. However, it’s worth noting there are many marginalized statuses within the furry community. Depending on the study, we find more than 70 per cent of furries identify as LGBTQ+ and more than 25 per cent are gender-identity diverse.

[–] atzanteol@sh.itjust.works 2 points 2 days ago

I get furries (well, enough for the purposes of this conversation at least), but they are different than "therians" right? I'm not as familiar with the term but it seems that they are people who identify as an animal not with.

The issue I have is that the wording here is pretty handwavy

This is pretty clearly a social and psychological phenomenon, not a neurological trait having nothing to do with a system of neurological development (influenced by hormones, for example).

I'm not so sure it's quite so "clear" to anyone that doesn't study these topics in detail. And I don't know enough about what is or is not a neurological trait.

To the best of our knowledge, hormones don’t influence the animals you like or identify with.

That's a good point. But the brain does and the brain is an organ as Steve points out. Is the difference of one being influenced by hormones sufficient?

That's the hair I'm trying to split.