Just buy a used Honda, Mazda, or Toyota that is pre-2016. None of those will have telemetry, subscription features, etc. They do collect data, which is stored locally, but that is required for accident investigations and to adjust the engine control systems.
this post was submitted on 15 Oct 2024
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Right to Repair
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Whether it be electronics, automobiles or medical equipment, the manufacturers should not be able to horde “oem” parts, render your stuff useless if you repair it with aftermarket parts, or hide schematics of their products.
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I hope they keep making those pre 2016 cars!
I'm counting on it!
2nd buy used. I've never bought a new car and I never intended to. One time I bought a used car from a dealership and they were dishonest about the financing (I already had financing lined up from my Credit Union, they said they would be at the rate, they didn't but signed me up anyway). That, plus the fact that driving a car off a lot loses you 10-20% value new to used.
Used is cheaper, but sometimes if you break it down to price per expected mile, new is cheaper. For example a new $30,000 car that you expect to last for 160,000 miles is $0.1875 per mile.
A used car that's $20,000 with 55,000 miles already, that will also last 160,000 miles, is $0.19 per mile.
Take into account lower interest on new cars and, well, I'm not willing to do that math right now.
I just made those numbers up as an example, so of course it depends on what's available.
Meh, get an old Toyota or Honda. Those things are bulletproof. Basic maintenance isn't typically that spendy.
I bought my car brand new in 2011and I intend to drive it until the wheels fall off. I like the peace of mind that comes with knowing it has been well maintained and that no one before me abused it. I plan on buying whatever replaces it new as well. Although I do have a great deal of anxiety about it due to all the stupid unnecessary shit they're putting in new cars these days.
looses
releases, sets free.
loses
depreciates, something is LOST
Every manufacturer is pretty bad on this front: https://foundation.mozilla.org/en/privacynotincluded/articles/its-official-cars-are-the-worst-product-category-we-have-ever-reviewed-for-privacy/
Best bet is probably buying an older used car. I've heard of some people disconnecting their antennas; not sure how hard that is.
I have a 2024 Mitsubishi Mirage, which is really a 2012 Mirage with new body panels. It has a screen but no functions without plugging in a phone, and practically everything is implemented as non-computerized as possible.
Oh wow that sounds too good to be true, I'll take a look at it :O
Late to the party but I used to work in the Auto industry.
The brands I trust in order: Toyota, Honda, Volkswagen, Mazda, Subaru.
That's the whole list. Brands outside this list tend to produce dogshit cars, IMHO.
Brands on the list are known for being fairly reliable and easy to maintain. Buy the lowest trim options for the least amount of tech if that's your prerogative.
After their 10$ subscription to remote start, I'd remove Mazda from the list.
Also, their diesel engines were shit and I would avoid one at all costs. My wife used to own a Mazda CX-5 diesel and it developed severe engine problems that were beyond fixing six months in, we sold it for 40% of what we bought it for.
Subaru remote start through their service is $150/yr. You can still go third party remotes though if you want to buy and install yourself.
trust
Yeah, except for the little fact that they all lied about fuel economy and cheated on emissions testing.
Better to just pick a car from before they started doing all that shit. Dont buy anything after 2020. I had a 2019 Honda Civic it was amazing but then some asshat running a stop sign totalled it.
Honestly, don't buy anything after 2005. Electronic throttle is shit.
There is no company that does not engage in anti-consumer data collection practices. Mozilla tried to rank them a couple of years ago, but they couldn't because every single brand got an F on their grading rubric. That being said, anything can be airgapped if you're handy. Just disconnect the antenna(e) and you should be golden.
In regards to reliability, Toyota is and has been the golden standard. Mitsubishi/Nissan/Honda are a mixed bag. Stellantis has been a complete shitshow for a long time. VAG and BMW tend to be reliable, but expensive to fix. Ford and GM tend to be unreliable, but cheap to fix. Hyundai has improved massively over the past 20 years, and now has several models built like tanks, but also several that continue to be tire fires.
I don't know what your means are, but I'd get something small and budget oriented for a first car. Smaller cars are generally safer and cheaper, and lower engine power will help make the car more controllable in adverse conditions. If you have the option, a manual gearbox is cheaper to own, and it's a good skill to learn.
Edit: Also, don't buy a car the first year of a generation or a model. Don't buy a car on a rainy day. Do wait until the end of the month/quarter/year if buying from a dealership. Do find a local, independent mechanic who is reliable and trustworthy.
What's the logic on the rainy day thing?
Rain hides scratches and dents.
Every single modern car tracks what you do in it and where.
Like everyone else here, I say buy used. Pretty much all of them spy on you or require some kind of subscription to use all of the hardware you already paid for.
Buy a 1980s mercedes diesel
I currently drive my parents diesel car so if I buy one it would not be too hard to adjust to :D
Something pre-00's, but I'm a weird masochist.
I would get a late-model Toyota and call in via the SOS button to disable the telematics. It's a documented process and isn't like pulling teeth. A company that respects through-and-through doesn't really exist.
Find a model that has what you want and doesn't use any phone apps.
The car itself is more important. You can trade powertrain dependability for a nicer interior with a Kia, you can get superior packaging in a Honda, etc. Options also vary between trims, etc.
Going down the Toyota route my friend recommended Lexus recently as its the luxury version of all the same models
In the US, you're probably best off with an older Nissan Leaf. It's got a big community behind it for mods and upgrades.
Don't buy a Tesla, or an ICE car, for obvious reasons.
What if they need to drive further than 60 miles. I follow the old leaf community and it's not where you want to start with cars.
A far better option will be the 1st gen hyundai kona electric (2018 model i think). If memory serves me right, the 1st gen did not have connected tech features because it had no inbuilt connectivity. It is also a proper modern EV with a ~40kWh and 64kWh battery options which will give much more usable range (200-400km depending on the battery size and usage pattern)
Look for a used luxury car being sold by the first owner.
The car was probably garaged and well maintained.
Unless it's a Lexus, do not do that.
I don't know much about cars so I thought Lexus is Toyota's high end brand? Is there something wrong with them? Do they use Ford parts or something?
From what I know, they are just very expensive to repair/ work on. Also difficult to work on which requires a well trained mechanic
I won't have the money for the repair then :(
Oh what I meant was only get a lexus. Don't get a mercedes or BMW. Lexus is mostly Toyota parts and incredibly reliable.
Disabling OnStar by pulling the fuse should keep cars from phoning home with info. I don't know if they still collect it though.
Buy a used car before 2010. Otherwise good fucking luck