this post was submitted on 06 Oct 2023
69 points (94.8% liked)
Python
6416 readers
1 users here now
Welcome to the Python community on the programming.dev Lemmy instance!
📅 Events
Past
November 2023
- PyCon Ireland 2023, 11-12th
- PyData Tel Aviv 2023 14th
October 2023
- PyConES Canarias 2023, 6-8th
- DjangoCon US 2023, 16-20th (!django 💬)
July 2023
- PyDelhi Meetup, 2nd
- PyCon Israel, 4-5th
- DFW Pythoneers, 6th
- Django Girls Abraka, 6-7th
- SciPy 2023 10-16th, Austin
- IndyPy, 11th
- Leipzig Python User Group, 11th
- Austin Python, 12th
- EuroPython 2023, 17-23rd
- Austin Python: Evening of Coding, 18th
- PyHEP.dev 2023 - "Python in HEP" Developer's Workshop, 25th
August 2023
- PyLadies Dublin, 15th
- EuroSciPy 2023, 14-18th
September 2023
- PyData Amsterdam, 14-16th
- PyCon UK, 22nd - 25th
🐍 Python project:
- Python
- Documentation
- News & Blog
- Python Planet blog aggregator
💓 Python Community:
- #python IRC for general questions
- #python-dev IRC for CPython developers
- PySlackers Slack channel
- Python Discord server
- Python Weekly newsletters
- Mailing lists
- Forum
✨ Python Ecosystem:
🌌 Fediverse
Communities
- #python on Mastodon
- c/django on programming.dev
- c/pythorhead on lemmy.dbzer0.com
Projects
- Pythörhead: a Python library for interacting with Lemmy
- Plemmy: a Python package for accessing the Lemmy API
- pylemmy pylemmy enables simple access to Lemmy's API with Python
- mastodon.py, a Python wrapper for the Mastodon API
Feeds
founded 1 year ago
MODERATORS
you are viewing a single comment's thread
view the rest of the comments
view the rest of the comments
I don't do enough for it to matter, what's wrong with 3?
It's different enough.
There are huge python 2 codebases that can't easily be ported to python 3.
Meh. I’ve ported a fair many py2 projects to 3. At this point just bite the bullet. Even from a security standpoint. Trying to not let my bias seep through - but it’s been so long.
Ever worked on a giant corporate codebase? I'm not saying you're wrong, but corporate internals often work counter to common sense or sanity. You'll have a giant mess of code, that would require months of work to port. The longer you wait, the more expensive it will get, but if you just wait long enough, it might not be the current manager's problem anymore. So it will be postponed and postponed.
I've seen this in real life a few times. EOL driven development. You just wait until it's absolutely impossible not to upgrade, then you hastily stop everything, do the porting in a marathon of sadness that basically rewrites everything, and if you're done, you can wait for the next EOL.
20 years on giant enterprise codebases. And any enterprise worth their salt at this point will be scanning these servers and flagging eosl software.
My experience the last five years of the 20 - security and service life trumps all fucking complaints about complexity.
To the point where it’s the opposite and I’m fielding weekly questions about why we’re still running an older 3.7.9 version. Among 50 other things.
Yet, there are enough companies that simply don't care. Yes, that's bad, but it's also reality.
The trick is to assign someone the responsibility of the upgrade and give them the authority to tell the other developers how their newly added code shall look like. This will get you there eventually.
Seen it work on a >1 million SLOC project.
Yeah but that requires good planning and better team structure.
That's low margin and therefore doesn't happen often enough.
Only if you can actually upgrade piece by piece. In a monolith, you often enough can't just upgrade new lines/methods. In those cases, it's halt all development, pull everyone into upgrading and then continue.
Nothing, because it's not related to Python 3.
Python 2 had one mostly-working
strclass, and a mostly-brokenunicodeclass.Python 3, for some reason, got rid of the one that mostly worked, leaving no replacement. The closest you can get is to spam
surrogateescapeeverywhere, which is both incorrect and has significant performance cost - and that still leaves several APIs unavailable.Simply removing
strindexing would've fixed the common user mistake if that was really desirable. It's not likeunicodeindexing is meaningful either, and now large amounts of historical data can no longer be accessed from Python.Thanks for that context. Seems odd that they would remove the
strinstead of taking the time to fix it.It's because
unicodewas really broken, and a lot of the obvious breakage was when people mixed the two. So they did fix some of the obvious breakage, but they left a lot of the subtle breakage (in addition to breaking a lot of existing correct code, and introducing a completely nonsensicalbytesclass).