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Southern Defense Forces struck a locomotive hauling Russian equipment, destroying 13 tanks and over 100 armored and automotive vehicles. Z-bloggers claim FPV drones were hidden in a grain car. (sopuli.xyz)

submitted 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) by LaFinlandia@sopuli.xyz to c/ukraine@sopuli.xyz

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[-] peoplebeproblems@midwest.social 54 points 1 year ago

This is amazing.

The Kremlin has always been paranoid. And now, Ukraine is giving them something to be paranoid about. Every transport is a risk. Every storage container. Every warehouse. I doubt the Kremlin has enough loyalty to have people screen everything that can potentially have explosive drones.

What's better? I would be willing to bet that the transporting and storage of the drones is entirely unknown by the drivers and workers. I'll bet someone was paid to get "sanctioned supplies" into Russia. Hell, they could actually be sending them with sanctioned stuff.

This could be a devastating psychological warfare strategy that may just work against the world's biggest psychological threat.

[-] OmegaLemmy@discuss.online 2 points 1 year ago

isn't using civilian infrastructure to hide military stuff like a warcrime or illegal

[-] OmegaLemmy@discuss.online 6 points 1 year ago

apparently:

Loss of Protected Status:
- Civilian transport loses its legal protection if used for military purposes (e.g., transporting weapons or combatants).
- Once identified as a military objective, it becomes a lawful target for attack, endangering civilians nearby.
Perfidy (Treachery):
- Prohibited under Article 37 of Additional Protocol I to the Geneva Conventions.
- Using civilian symbols (e.g., Red Cross/Red Crescent emblems, UN markings) to disguise military operations constitutes perfidy.
- Example: Hiding missiles in an ambulance marked with a red cross to deceive the enemy.
War Crimes under the Rome Statute:
- Intentionally using protected civilian objects to shield military operations qualifies as a war crime (Article 8(2)(b)(xxiii)).

[-] peoplebeproblems@midwest.social 9 points 1 year ago

To me that says no.

There was no civilian aid symbology as far as we know, no UN, etc. Russia probably wouldn't allow them in anyway.

[-] itslilith@lemmy.blahaj.zone 8 points 1 year ago

So TL;DR, no, this is legitimate deception, as long as it's not coming from anything that pretends to be humanitarian aid or other protected status

The only potentially war-crime part is making Russian civilians unwitting accomplices and potential targets.

[-] anzo@programming.dev 1 points 1 year ago

The only potentially war-crime part is making Russian civilians unwitting accomplices and potential targets.

That's no war-crime. That is Kremlin against their own people (murder is not war crime..)

[-] itslilith@lemmy.blahaj.zone 1 points 1 year ago

I am not a lawyer, and doubly so when it comes to international law. But what Ukraine was doing in these operations might, might constitute a war crime, since this is transporting materiel and launching an attack from trucks that are driven by enemy civilians. That's pretty close to a human shield. I am not sure if trickery, as opposed to coercion, makes a difference when it comes to these things, and also, for them to be human shields someone has to figure out there's a target there in the first place.

When Russia is, y'know, just straight up using human shields: https://lieber.westpoint.edu/weaponizing-civilians-human-shields-ukraine/

I'm not saying this to demean the operation, it was brilliant. But international law is complicated, so I'm sure there's some war crimes to be found when you dig deep enough.

Слава Україні!

[-] ayyy@sh.itjust.works 4 points 1 year ago

The concept of a war crime has not existed for at least 50 years now.

[-] BetaBlake@lemmy.world 43 points 1 year ago

These drones are beginning to be like bed bugs, the Russians are going to wonder if they're hiding in everything, that's hilarious.

Keep it up Ukraine

[-] LaFinlandia@sopuli.xyz 34 points 1 year ago

[-] jonne@infosec.pub 11 points 1 year ago

They should hide them in toilets and washing machines near the front line, eventually they'll end up back in Russia.

[-] Etterra@discuss.online 6 points 1 year ago

That's overkill. Better to just stick a block of C4 under the seat with a pressure switch so that when you plop your Rusky ass down you get inducted into the Russian space program.

[-] fluxion@lemmy.world 27 points 1 year ago

I like to think Ukraine has months worth of attacks like this that catch Russia completely with their pants down.

[-] snoons@lemmy.ca 4 points 1 year ago

The Russians entire ideology centres around dick swinging, so it's no surprise their pants are down and will continue to be down because it's all they know.