A bigger problem is school sponsored spyware on the devices. Weird how they don't mention that:
https://www.eff.org/wp/school-issued-devices-and-student-privacy
https://time.com/7275031/spy-high-true-story-prime-video/
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/feb/19/schools-spied-on-students-webcams
I'm not sure how that's a surprise to anyone. Keep your personal stuff off hardware that doesn't belong to you.
They used the onboard cameras to take pictures of kids in their bedrooms.
It’s definitely a surprise to most students. Not really reasonable to expect people who have never been taught tech to understand tech.
now try explaining that to a kid. it'll maybe stick in high school.
No. Keep your creepy spy hardware off of kids that don't belong to you.
There should be 1 class for computer and tech. The rest of school can be done with pencil, paper, and a ruler.
Districts should stop playing the marketing game and spend money repairing buildings, buying up to date textbooks, and fucking paying teachers more.
Pay teachers more, free breakfast and lunch for every child. These two things are the only things that you can just throw money at to improve outcomes that can be replicated everywhere.
As a generalization, they don't need more money for textbooks, they don't need more tech, they don't need building upgrades, they don't need whatever the latest software scam is, etc.
I saw somewhere that general tech in schools makes students worse overall by 2/3 of a standard deviation. A class on it is an great approach, and the constant live experimentation on our youth education needs to stop. The pain of learning isn’t optional, I say.
One class seems too few. 75% of jobs in the US use computers regularly.
Even the plumber shows up with a tablet and such.
On top of that, what ever was the point in making us write the essay twice, rough draft, the final... and have to rewrite the whole damn thing if we made a mistake. When it comes to writing, computers are where it is done.
Math... yeah, pencil and paper, calculator for the high level stuff.
History/social studies... videos and articles are just easier to distribute via computer. Though initial presentation with follow up commentary is ideal.
I think computers are overused in school, but 1 class is too far in the other direction.
My mum gave me her old slide-rule that she'd used as a kid. Kinda mechanical calculator, very early computing tech. She told me that there was debate about whether kids should be allowed to use them in school or just calculate manually. She said they were taught to do it manually then when they could do that they were taught slide rule, because many jobs would expect people to have slide rule skills.
When I was little, calculators still had kinda bulbs for each digit, then LCD screens came along and they suddenly got small and more powerful. There was the same controversy about whether we should be allowed to use them in class. We were taught how to do algebra n shit with paper and pencil, but also how to use the calculator.
This has worked for the past couple of generations of tech, I don't see why this one should be handled any differently. Kids should learn Pythagoras and algebra n stuff, how to do it themselves. Then they should be taught how to do it using a computer, and all the other stuff you can do with the computer.
Honestly, computer lessons in schools need to step up, at least in my country. Back in the 80s we were taught on 32k ram BBC B computers - we only had to learn to code a bit of basic, but those of us who wanted to dig deeper could learn assembly, start fucking with registers n stuff, learning binary and hex. Gave me a very basic understanding of how a computer actually worked.
I'm told that in my country, kids these days are taught how to use office. And that's about all. Fuckin shame and a missed opportunity for those children who are drawn to tech and want to dig deep.
So yeah, I'm just saying we gotta teach them to do math on paper, really understand it - and then we gotta teach them the tech.
Tech has a place in the classroom, but that place isn’t “everything everywhere all at once” and I think there is a good value in teaching kids when they’re young when and where to put their phones and tablets down.
Tech has a place yes, the problem is school admins have chosen to use it as a replacement for competent, well compensated teachers.
I think this is one of the biggest missed opportunities in education.
We put "technology" in front of students, but mostly in the form of locked-down devices, prescribed apps, and step-by-step workflows. That teaches compliance, not understanding.
There's a huge difference between using software and understanding how it works, how to break it, fix it, or build your own.
Basic exposure to things like Linux, hardware setup, networking, and programming would give kids agency instead of just familiarity. Even if they don't pursue tech careers, they'd come out far more capable of navigating (and questioning) the systems around them.
Digital safety is a big one. Not just "don’t click bad links" but actual operational awareness: privacy, tracking, permissions, data ownership. The stuff that matters in reality.
I get that there are constraints like funding, vendor lock-in, teacher workload, curriculum pressure. But the current model feels like it's optimised to produce competent consumer users of systems, not people who can shape them.
Feels like a massive wasted opportunity.
You’re partly right. Did you read the article? One of the chief complaints is that in fact the devices aren’t locked down and kids are using them for things like games and youtube.
You’re in a Lemmy echo-chamber for the rest of it. The average user isn’t us.
As for the rest, schools teach to the lowest common denominator. The article itself plainly shows that the people “in charge” haven’t a clue how to effectively monitor, limit, and control usage of these basic devices. So throwing more at them isn’t the solution when they can’t even manage what they’ve got.
The problem is they can't control Chromebooks. Give them a Linux laptop with a purposeful distro that doesn't allow them to play Minecraft. Boom, problem solved.
Minecraft isn't the problem.
The problem is the 24/7 input of corporate right wing propaganda and brainwashing.
What does that have to do with computers?
A lot, TBH. The walled garden is everything in tech these days. When you control the platform and make it hard to leave, you control the flow of information.
Claude, please find a linux 0-day to root my school laptop so that I can play Minecraft.
That's fine, some kids will do that, and I hope they do. But they will be a minority.
It's a valuable part of the education....
If a fifth grader uses copy.fail to gain root access on their Chromebook I say we let them have some extra Minecraft time.
In my son’s fifth grade class last year, it was fucking Cookie Clicker. 🙄
The problem is there is no compelling data that these devices are superior for learning. They are distractions and expense with no proven benefit.
There's some benefit... my daughter was assigned a Window 11 Lenovo the last two tears and now hates Microsoft AND Windows.
Her personal laptop runs linux.
You could have created a temporary dual boot to teach her that in a weekend. Parents are so lazy these days.
Nah, her kind of deep seated hatred comes from required usage over time, not from a weekend. Short term exposure just doesn't do it.
It doesn't matter if they're superior or not, they need to learn to use them, because every job is going to expect them to be able to.
I think it would take a pretty big effort to keep kids from learning how to use basic functions on tablets or laptops. They are inundated with these in and out of school. They don't need to use them in school to be comfortabke with them on the job market.
Another mother, Jenny Sullivan, said she has noticed her fourth grade son capitalizing random letters and not getting corrected
If it's good enough for the President...
Tech isn’t the problem. It’s teaching kids to think critically. It’s hard to do regardless of what device you are using and it’s next to impossible with large class sizes.
Writing things out by hand does give kids time to think in larger classes where they can’t help guide their own lesson, though.
Bingo. Not a tech issue, it is a pedagogical issue. The way we teach hasn't changed in 50 years. The problem is systemic. Teachers are taught to develop lesson plans in antiquated ways. Teachers aren't encouraged or empowered to innovate. Funding is insufficient. Testing takes priority over learning because funding is tied to scores. Then you've got big tech lobbying to suckle at the teet of taxpayer dollars influencing decisions being made where the interest of children and learning is secondary.
With things like learning long division or cursive handwriting I think we frequently run into the doorman fallacy. There is so much value in teaching people to think and teaching people to learn that we get distracted by everything having to be a useful skill for future employment.
Good. My son's school is already tired of me.
Did people honestly think giving 10 year olds school-issued laptops would end well in the slightest? Like, seriously?
I never knew of anyone who didn't use their school-issued devices for anything other than browser games most of the time. They literally used it for games rather than school work.
You can't hand them the reins and then complain that they're even worse now. Schools are partially to blame for all this electronics bullshit kids are into these days. A lot of middle and high schools almost require students to have a fucking iPad these days.
This just reminded me; my first time playing Pokemon Gold/Silver was on a computer in my school library using a fan translation patch like 6 months before the English release.
Good times.
The biggest issues this article points out seem like failures of the IT department/teachers (or those telling the teachers how to teach).
It's not hard to block a kid from running minecraft, and relying on duolingo to teach your kids is just idiotic. Why send them to school in the first place if they could just as easily do duolingo at home? Only let the kids have their devices out when it's necessary for the assignment, and have them put them away when it's not.
But it's the way of the future! How else are you going to learn a trade that trillions will be spent trying to make irrelevant?
Bring back the slate. Schools aren't getting all of that extra money, big tech is. And big tech already has too much money and too much power and way not enough seriousness.
Wait until we find out that the school-assigned devices are always listening, and everything is being scanned for keywords by the NSA, and they're taking action based on what they hear, arresting and deporting people.
It sounds insane, but this is MAGAmerica. If this was the top story tomorrow, I wouldn't be surprised, at all. Think of this when the Administration says they are going to give a free laptop or tablet to every American schoolchild.
This is a most excellent place for technology news and articles.
