this post was submitted on 12 Feb 2024
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What breaks if you let a monster have multiple actions? (ttrpg.network)
submitted 9 months ago by Khrux@ttrpg.network to c/dm_academy@lemmy.world
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This is for D&D 5e.

I'm currently making a reoccurring antagonist NPC that is a master thief. It's CR 6 and I want it to be capable of making three attacks per round like multiattack but also have their thief subclass's enhanced cunning action with fast hands.

This would normally mean they'd get 3 attacks and a varying options for bonus actions, however I'd want them to be able to trade up to three if these attacks to have more uses of cunning action (this would of course stack the ability to dash 4 times per round but I'd just not do that while running the monster). They also have a special once per day ability that I'd want them to be able to swap a single attack for.

It got me thinking, instead of trying to make an unwieldy combination of multiattack, a special action and cunning action, could I just give them three actions?

The simple way this NPC works that I want them to pick 3 options from:

  • Dagger
  • Crossbow
  • Special action
  • Dash
  • Disengage
  • Hide
  • Make an ability check
  • Use an object
  • Use a set of tools

At this point, what do I actually lose from letting them take 3 actions? They aren't a Spellcaster so I'm not worried about them throwing out three fireballs or the like.

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[–] groet@feddit.de 10 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Things to consider when having a single enemy have multiple actions: how much can they do without any possible player input. Can they 100->0 a player with 3 attacks? Can they get into range, attack, move out of range, so on their turns the melee players have to dash and never get to attack? Legendary actions split the bosses turn into multiple initiative steps to allow players to react in between actions.

It could be a cool fight, if the boss gets to do one thing after every player turn (either move, action, or bonus action). It completely changes the fight dynamic and might run into problems for actions that also use movement etc but it feels more interactive than getting hit by an enemy that always runs out of your movent range after every attack.

[–] Khrux@ttrpg.network 1 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

I initially built them as having multiattack before thinking of this, and they'd only get as many actions as the number of attacks, so they wouldn't be risking instantly downing a PC more than any creature with standard multiattack.

As for yo-yoing on the edge of their attack range, I think I'll lower their weapon range and their special ability basically requires them to consistently read aloud from a grimour, so I'll half their movement while that's active (they'll either be retreating entirely or using the book).

The main reason I'm hesitant with legendary actions is that I already use the MCDM villain actions and this NPC is going to be encountered with basically a heist team, so I don't want to manage too much for this creature off their turn.

Edit: Thinking about it more, I'm happy not making it all happen in a turn and giving them two legendary actions, however for the sake of versatility, I don't see an issue with making those legendary actions "The thief takes an action".

[–] Jeeve65@ttrpg.network 6 points 9 months ago (1 children)

If it's a recurring villain, I would give them legendary actions which usually do exactly what you describe: it allows to make another attack, or use a feature. It is also not in the same turn, so it would even enhance their sneak attack (assuming they have that, too).

[–] Khrux@ttrpg.network 1 points 9 months ago

Thinking about it more, I'm happy not making it all happen in a turn and giving them two legendary actions, however for the sake of versatility, I don't see an issue with making those legendary actions "The thief takes an action".

[–] Nikko882@lemmy.world 4 points 9 months ago (1 children)

I don't think giving them a feature that says "Multiattack: Master Thief makes 3 attacks. Alternatively it can replace any number of those attacks with Cunning Action or Special Action." comes too long or cumbersome. Assuming I understood you right and that is what you are looking to do.

Legendary Actions, as has already been suggested is also a good call.

Or you can just give them 3 actions, that works. Because you are the DM you just have to notice and make a call when an unintended interaction comes up and avoid abusing it. Only thing I can think of is abilities where "as an action" is supposed to translate to "as their turn". Things like breaking out of an Entangle spell. You should probably avoid just doing that multiple times to not make the person who cast the spell feel like it was useless due to this unconventional situation.

[–] Khrux@ttrpg.network 2 points 9 months ago

The cumbersome element comes fromcthe combination of Multiattack: Master Thief makes 3 attacks. Alternatively it can replace any number of those attacks with Cunning Action or Special Action and *Cunning action. The master thief makes may take the dash, disengage or hide action, or make a sleight of hand check, use an object or use thieves tools.

I'm not totally against breaking it into legendary actions, I suppose the dilemma is less about "should it be legendary actions" and more "should it be any action or limited to specific choices" i.e. If I made the theif have two legendary actions per round and its option was "the tbief takes an action", I cant imagine it breaking anything that adding cunning action, and multiattack separately wouldn't do too, and I'm worried I'm overlooking something here.

[–] owenfromcanada@lemmy.world 2 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

If you want something mechanically simpler, it sounds like giving your NPC a permanently hasted condition would accomplish most of what you're asking. Two actions, extra movement, plus the Thief bonus actions would allow for three attacks per turn (if dual wielding).

Other answers recommending legendary actions are great too. But if you wanted your NPC to be more "vanilla," the perma-haste might work.