huh, never heard of that one, I’ll add it to the list, always good to have backup options.

In reply to to other points further up:

Android isn’t Google.

Yes it is, both the Wikipedia and the official website both state this.

I don't mean to get in to a slap fight but it's not really a subjective issue, android is still owned/run by google.

Though they didn't create it iirc, it was bought while it was still quite young.

Have you ever installed android before? By default, it’s without gapps.

Also not true, the official android comes with GMS and the Play suite (services, store etc).

Though there are places where some of the Play suite apps are not allowed to be bundled (iirc china does this), the default is still to include them.

Given that you're mentioning lineageOS then i'm assuming you mean the AOSP which afaict does indeed come without the GMS + normal google bs.

While both are "official", I can't think of any reasonable metric where the AOSP (and it's forks/derivatives) would be considered the the default.

I get the impression that's supposed to be some kind of gotcha, kinda seems like projection though.

If you don't want to (or feel like you can't) engage on a point, no one is forcing you, it says enough that this is your response.

That's just it, it's not.

It's a whole economy based on the threat of neverending warfare.

An actual war, where they aren't just stomping on something from a great height, that is short term benefit compared to selling them the re-up every cycle, "just in case"

Military keeping up with the Joneses.

Hey now, that's a lot of animosity for a statement that doesn't do much to make a good point.

The original question was

Show me a ban that didn’t came with 10x problems

I posited a conjecture based guess with some basic reasoning and as i said , it was opinion more than provable fact.

By "worked out" i meant the overall situation is better after the ban, despite the negative consequences.

It seems that was lost on you, but now you know.

So let's address your reasoning, such as it is.

People died from tainted drugs before the ban, probably a lot from tainted drugs of the type in the ban.

Unless you have any evidence those numbers changed significantly after the ban, I'll chalk that up to your opinion.

Not a very reasonable one to my eyes, but such are angry people on the internet.

I was not aware i needed to provide an example of a ban that resulted in everything being completely fixed after the fact (mainly because that's not how the question was worded) but if that was, in fact, the requirement, my bad.

If I'm a monster (in your opinion) because i think the reduction in access to terribly addictive drugs might have overall brought down fatalities and other negative consequences, then i can live with that.

Even when learning to play a instrument you get feedback. When you twang the strings with your inexpert fingers and make a sound. That’s a huge source of guidance.

Ah, so you meant feedback.

Agreed.

I don't think we're actually disagreeing, i think i just misunderstood what you meant.

I do know from personal experience, anecdotal as it may be, that there are situations where certain feedback isn't registered properly, or at all.

This example is fully contrived, but I'm going somewhere after so bear with me.

Take the example of the gym and that the feedback is the muscle soreness experienced after, what happens if that person doesn't feel pain ( again, i know it's contrived ). The effect would still be there but the feedback wouldn't be registered.

I know pain isn't the only feedback here I'm using this specific example as reference.

So meditation is a good example here, especially for the neurodivergent.

Let's take the semi-common comorbidity of Alexithymia.

Not being able to recognise or properly associate the emotional feedback of whatever method of meditation you are practicing does somewhat limit the understanding of the process/benefits.

But, and this is key, it doesn't actually inhibit all of the effects of the meditation.

There is ofc a cognitive aspect to using the feedback to guide what you are doing, but it's not a hard requirement.

Think of it like emotional exercise where at some point your mind just buckles under strain it didn't know was there and up until that point nothing was feeling any different.

It can be deeply unpleasant and even harmful, but it can also be a benefit if handled in a useful way.

I'm not saying it's common, but i'd imagine its more likely than you think.

Hmm , i was working with the assumption you meant tangible results/benefits, seems i was incorrect and i retract my statement partially.

I will however die on the hill that not everything has immediate (or immediately noticeable to be more accurate) effects.

Learning to play an instrument doesn't always result in an immediate increase in ability, same with martial arts (the skill portion, not the physical/exercise portion).

If you limit yourself to only the things that have immediately noticeable effects then you are excluding potential paths for growth.

A worldwide revolution in which everyone unites against the "ruling class" isn't a viable alternative in and of itself, that's like saying "world peace".

An example of an alternative would be something which could fill in the blank in this sentence and make sense.

"Don't boycott products/companies, that isn't how you achieve your goal, what you should be doing is "

This is not a war between nations but a war between class

The issue i have with this isn't that it's a marxist cliche (i'll take your word on that, I've no idea) it's that it presents a false dichotomy in which a class war and a national war can't both be occurring at the same time.

The name is very specifically a reference to america

Fair enough, i could probably also do with being a bit less sarcastic to things that might just be honest mistakes.

As a genuine question, what point are you maintaining, I've lost the thread and don't know which one you mean?

Choosing not to engage can also be a positive rather than just the prevention of negatives.

Depends on how you define 'cost' I suppose, but seems like the trade off isn't worth it for you, which is fair.

Some might value the perceived benefits much higher than you do.

What if the life I'm imagining I'm protecting is one where I have the option of choosing a platform/application that isn't scraping the absolute dregs of the barrel to squeeze out that last bit of profit margin.

That's a win win right?