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I have problems with people who abstained. The hard thing is, how do you change voter behavior?
this post was submitted on 06 Feb 2025
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Strawman?
6.27 Million more people voted for Biden in 2020 than Harris in 2024. That's not strawmanning, those fuckers stayed home and that is exactly why we are in the current situation.
Cool. Neither party was palatable for a huge amount of people, wonder why.
If I'm offered a plate of tomatoes, which I hate, and a pile of shit as choices to eat, both are not palatable to me. But that doesn't make them the same.
Yes but if the person handing you the tomatoes had been handing you tomatoes your entire life while promising chocolate cake you'd be a lot less happy about it. Especially if they also said "We're not going to change anything and if you have a problem with tomatoes you need to take Econ 203 to understand why you're wrong for being upset."
Democrats need to get people enthusiastic to vote. Not getting shit on a plate is not enough to get people to vote.
I voted. But for a lot of people it was like this,
You hear about a restaurant that only serves shit and tomatoes. So you don't go. I understand that that isn't really how that works but that is how so many felt about this.
I don't wanna beat the analogy into the ground so I'll let it go. But the point is, ones of them was going to be president. You will HAVE to deal with one of them. Refusing to vote is making the statement that you're ok with the worst outcome, because of you weren't ok with it you would have taken action to prevent that worst outcome. This is the general "you", not you specifically obviously, since you voted.
I feel like a lot of people thought "I don't like either, so I won't vote" ignoring that they will be impacted either way, so it's not a matter of who you like, it's a matter of effecting the outcome to get the best result possible. Even if that isn't perfect for you.
I voted and I'm still impacted. It was a fruitless effort.
I agree with you. A lot of apathetic voters will only vote for something that will benefit them not to prevent something that may harm them in my experience.
Let’s say you’re completely right. How does insulting people’s poor choices 4 months ago help us in the present? We can’t create resistance and solidarity if we hold grievances from the past.
Because some people, mostly just tankies and anarchists pretending to be moral abstainers, are unapologetic about helping elect fascism. By exposing and shaming them, onlookers will reconsider their own stance.
There are actual Nazis in this administration, and you’re worried about “tankies?” Get it together man.
Because the people who enable to problem are part of the problem.
I'm a war you will cut off supply lines for the same reason, errode support. The commander doesn't say "people are dying on the front line and you're worried about stopping trucks transport bread? Get it together man."
God forbid the tankies should fight the Nazis again, right?
One’s enemies can exist on two fronts. It’s happened before.
You’re in good company
They're literally saying Nazis are also their enemies.
So is Dulles. He said "greater threat".
Where is your evidence that the person above believes the same thing?
...I'm sorry, what?
Are you or are you not claiming that @Rhoeri above considers Nazis to be the lesser threat? Since that's been the direction this conversation was in when you joined.
I'm claiming Dulles considered Nazis a threat. Smaller than the Soviets, but still a threat.
How dishonest of you to pretend this discussion had no context.
Unfortunately, it does.
Or are you saying you don't understand how context works?
Oh for fuck's..
@finitebanjo: $Tankies_rant @TokenBoomer: The Nazis are in power, and you're fighting tankies? @Rhoeri: Yes, there's two fronts @TokenBoomer: Allen Dulles also thought Communists are the more important enemy You, direct quote: "They’re literally saying Nazis are also their enemies." Me: Yes, exactly.
That is the context. Dulles thought communists are a "graver threat" than the Nazis, meaning he, also, considers both to be a threat. I don't know who Rhoeri considers worse, (though if this is anything to go by, finitebanjo seems to think they're one and the same). Either are welcome to elaborate their position at their leisure should they see fit. If the "greater enemy" is what you wanted to pivot the argument around, your reply should have read "They never said Nazis were the greater threat", the way you phrased it, it looks like you're misunderstanding Dulles.
On a separate note, I resent you starting this conversation with a sliding tackle, demanding evidence, calling me dishonest and pretending, and ending on an implied insult. Stop trying to spin minor misunderstandings into full blown arguments. You're getting a reputation, and so is .world, and it's for a reason.
You are now bringing other users into this in order to obfuscate what you originally said.
Also, I really don't care what you think my reputation is and I'm not sure why you think I do.
As for .world, you're free to stop using it any time. At least, I assume no one is forcing you to. Are they? Should the authorities be contacted?
I rest my case.
Your case that you told me what you think my reputation is as if I would care?
Your case that you're still going to use lemmy.world even though you don't like it?
Okay then.
The Tankies are promoting abstaining to help elect the actual Nazis and it fucking worked, so yes I'm worried about the fucking Tankies.
Tankies want 1 thing: "the end of US Imperialism" which is to say for us to all off ourselves so that NATO stops getting in China's way.
Are the tankies in the room with us now?
Take a look around.
Yes.
Are the Tankies in office? Prioritize and Organize.
Well...
2018
2020
2025
Yeah, fucking looks like it.
JDPON Don strikes again.
Maybe if some of them would accept responsibility, it would go a long way towards creating that resistance.
I’d actually have a lot of respect for someone someone that could admit they made a huge mistake, because it means they are self aware enough to know that their own behavior has consequences also.
And I can get behind people humble enough to own their mistakes.
But most of these people have the gall to blame people who voted for Harris, or blame Harris herself for not being perfect in every way.
So unless they find some humility, there won’t be any solidarity and I would even go so far as to urge others to refuse to find solidarity with anyone that does not have enough strength of character to own their mistakes.
Guess we should give up then, since things didn’t go our way. Right?
If that’s what you’re taking from what I said, then maybe your should read it again a few times.
Unless you mean to say that you’d rather suffer divided than own your part in the reason for it.