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Well diarrhea donny just raised the stakes again telling the Iranian Islamic Republic (in front of the rest of the world) that he is considering killing them all
Unlike the kiddy diddler, those people are hardened fanatics and find honour in death... shit is just going to be worse and worse
Thank you Muricans... your dumbassery will be painful (if not deadly) for the entire world and we only have you to thank for it
Not crucial to your point but this sort of orientalism too often goes unchallenged. They're not "hardened fanatics who find honor in death" (at least not any more than any other culture that values martyrdom, which is most of them); everything Iran has done so far can be explained through the cold hard math of geopolitics.
Agreed, what are US Marines but cold hard fanatics that find honor in death?
The US has cold soft fanatics that find honor in death (as long as some one else is doing all the fighting and dying)
That's why the US military is mostly people without better prospects or any prospects. Most of the people I served with came from two core demographics: trapped without hope of escape in the ghetto or trapped without hope of escape from rural bumble fuck. The somewhat literal fear of going back to where you came from vs obliterating a bunch of "bad people" is an easy math problem.
I didn’t serve, but nearly every male in the high school class before mine, mine and the class after mine did. We were one of those bum fuck areas where you couldn’t get a job unless you traveled 3 hours a day.
It was funny to watch the city and the country kids figure out that shit was fucked no matter where you came from.
When the factory and mill jobs left, nothing was there to replace that security.
While I understand your point... I think you will find a much larger number of people from Iran willing to become a suicide bomber compared to marines knowingly throwing themselves to death for the mission
I am not attempting to qualify either here are better or worse, just that religion fanatics are much more likely to go to extremes
you’re just flat wrong. american military propaganda and brainwashing is on par with the propaganda we are told happens in other militaries.
every accusation is an admission
I think you’re forgetting that US soldiers are also religious fanatics that grow up with the same level of abusive indoctrination.
I world put the "some" qualifier before US soldiers.
I've met my fair share that are who you describe, but I've also got some dear friends who worked in the military. One was because his dad is a two star general. The other was because it was the easiest way (for him) to get out of Utah. Both are religious, but they aren't zealots.
I honestly can't say for sure but I doubt it... anecdotally, the few Americans I know who did serve, did so as a way to get higher education paid for. None seem to have any particular love for what they were asked to do
This is of course anecdotal as I said, I do not know nearly enough people to say for sure nor have I read in-depth about this topic
In the current war, yes absolutely. Iran has been the most logical and reasonable party to this war.
But you seem to be missing my point. In Iran, thousands have been killed and their stance does not seem to change. In the USA, gas has gone up and that has done more to sway Americans against trump than the knowledge their government is actively killing thousands around the world, including women and children, without a second thought.
If push comes to shove, I would bet my bottom dollar Iran gov will hold until the end. The USA on the other hand, won't survive the AI bubble bursting.
This was ALL visible and demonstrated recently in the disaster that was the invasion of Iraq
You know how Americans came together and supported GWB to invade Iraq to get revenge for 911?
It's the same thing. The American terrorist attacks on Iran made them come together and vowed revenge, except they are actually targeting the terrorists that attacked them not another nation.
Well, they've thoroughly crushed their attacker and humiliated them, and they've successfully decolonized most of the region (US bases are closing and they're not returning). Why wouldn't they hold?
Uhhh... which part was visible and demonstrated? Iraq now has a US friendly government, it was a complete success. ISIS taking over was the disaster in Iraq, not the invasion itself. The US captured Saddam, put him through a sham trial and he was hung in a dark shed, stole the oil, destroyed the nation, and slaughtered millions of Iraqis.
They wanted to repeat that.
So the answer here is twofold: First, that's not being hardened fanatics; that's a difference in popular will. America has very little popular will to prosecute this war (because it's stupid and unnecessary and Trump didn't even try to sell the American public on it), so even relatively minor setbacks or consequences produce outsized popular resentment. It's also important to note here that Americans don't meaningfully care about the humanitarian impact of their military's escapades, so "done more to sway Americans against trump than the knowledge their government is actively killing thousands around the world" isn't exactly a high bar. Meanwhile, though we can't know for sure because not much information is coming out of Iran these days, Iran presumably has a lot of popular will to prosecute the war because America and Israel are bombing their schools and hospitals. Would you want your country (presumably America) to surrender if, say, Russia started bombing your country? As long as you have a meaningful avenue of resistance, you'd want to do that until you return the favor to them twice over. That's exactly what the British thought, so much so that even after losing an order of magnitude more people out of a smaller population in less time than Iran they not only didn't surrender, they beat back the Germans and went on to fight them in three continents, bankrupting their country, losing their empire in and enduring harsh wartime rationing in the process. As history has repeatedly shown, terror bombing doesn't work. That's not a trait of hardened fanatics; that's just being human.
And of course second, even if the Iranian public wanted to surrender, that doesn't matter much (unless shit really hits the fan), because the people who would actually make the decision to surrender aren't the public; they're the ruling class, who are in a better position to weather the storm than the average Iranian. They're also likely to very much not want to surrender because it's their corrupt rule at stake.
The Oriental fanatic to whom life is cheap contrasted with the enlightened and/or decadent white man is a an age-old trope, but put in context it's not one with a lot of explanatory power.
thanks for the detailed explanation
Iran, or Persia, is many times older than the USA. They figure this too shall pass.
How is that not a war crime in itself?
Because there is no such thing as a war crime. I wish this myth would die already, all it does is placate people into accepting war.
War crimes are definitely a thing. With a long history of definition and, you know, multiple international agreements.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/War_crime
And just as long of a history of them being completely ignored with zero accountability. It just mollifies and tricks unsuspecting soldiers into engaging in more warfare.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_convicted_war_criminals
You think this is a gotcha?
That's a completely brain dead take.
If the UN was actually dedicated to peace keeping they'd have arrested his ass for that shit.
The UN is just a forum that allows countries to air their grievances and talk out issues. It's there to hopefully stop wars before they start. It's not the world police
Which explains why they're so shit at it.
I'm tired of winning boss.
I am not my government, nor have i ever felt anything like "patriotism" at any point outside the Olympics, and that's always as fleeting as whichever event I am watching.
Much as Iranians aren't their government, Chinese aren't theirs, etc etc. Despots gonna despot.
And if you think he actually got voted in this most recent time then I've got some bridges for sale in Brooklyn for a great price if you're interested.
ETA: Hard-line religious repressive governments and the CCCP genociding Uyghrs(sp) are what I'm referring to, nothing more.
Also I'm dumb
That's not how a democracy works. And if you argue against it, then it's not a democracy any more
In the end, I don't think the rest of the world believes that this is all down to one person called Trump any more. This is down to the whole population and will require many generations of intentional cultural change to reverse.
The USA is lost to most of its allies, not because of Trump alone but because things there can unpredictably change very dramatically every 4 years
Oh, he got voted in by enough people to make this rapist, childfucking, insurrectionist garbage human president the second time. There is no functioning mechanism to prevent such things or to reverse course when things are obviously fucked, and that is the fault of every american alive, regardless of patriotism. It's not limited to a single generation either - this shit has been going down since at least Nixon, who got away scot free, and Reagan, who also didn't suffer any consequences for the Contra affair.
Every American alive - minus Gen Z / Alpha at the moment, but i am sure they will carry the torch on - is part of a system that has been running amok for more than half a century, and was neither willing to consistently vote for representants that respect the rule of law nor demand that the rules are changed in a way to prevent a fascist takeover.
It's just like with genocide - if you don't speak out against it, you support it.
Most of Gen Z were 18+ in 2024, they're already carrying the torch.
People on Lemmy need to actually internalize this fact^
Thank you for thinking that way and saying it "out loud".