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this post was submitted on 04 Oct 2026
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Leopards Ate My Face
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I would definitely like a situation where everyone in Ukraine and everyone in Russia can decide their futures democratically but yes, that's not likely to happen soon, particularly because Russia seems to have very little democracy.
Zelenskyy apparently had an approval rating in Ukraine of over 50%, and sometimes over 60%, earlier this year, and also apparently 71% of Ukrainians think that new elections should only be held after the war ends.
Russia has no right to invade Ukraine to impose Russia's will on Ukraine, such as the demand that Ukraine can never join NATO. Any flaws Ukraine may have don't justify Russia's murderous aggression.
If you view things differently then okay, but I guess that's how I view it.
Do those polls include the occupied territories? I doubt it. Bit hard to collect data in a war zone.
Let's say, hypothetically, that 90% of people in Puerto Rico want to be independent from the US. But, 60% of the US as a whole (including territories) want it to stay. Isn't the opinion of the people who actually live there more relevant?
As I said, I don't have clear evidence of what the people in the disputed territories want, other than the fact that the government of Ukraine felt the need to politically suppress them because they expected unfavorable results.
If armed men seizing government buildings is a legitimate form of protest, then the DPR was a legitimate political entity, Ukraine had no authority to assert control over it, and Russia was responding to their request for military assistance.
If armed men seizing government buildings is not a legitimate form of protest, then the government of Ukraine is illegitimate. Propping up an illegitimate government isn't something I'm interested in.
The only way to maintain this narrative where Ukraine is a legitimate democracy and Russia a murderous invader is if you completely ignore the undemocratic things one side does while treating similar things on the other side as disqualifying. Either way, so long as you're consistent then it's not so black and white.
We're just going in circles and I don't see an answer to that point, so I see little point in continuing. I am grateful, though, you're the first person to make it anywhere near this far without just calling me a bot or propagandist.
We have different ways of looking at it, so no I don't think there's a lot of point in more discussion. Sometimes people have different views.