The problem is willful ignorance. A lot of Trump supporters knew better from day 1 and chose to be easily fooled. I had a friend when I was a kid who used to cheer on the defendants in court cases when he thought they were guilty of heinous crimes because they got to "fuck with the system" if they got off. People like that grew up to vote for Trump because he would "fuck with the system".

I think it's ok to hate someone who voted for Trump BECAUSE they wanted to elect an enemy of the majority. It might not be productive to hate them, but it's okay to.

How long and how loudly... how open will their distaste for right wing

We're dumb evil immoral pedophiles who are going to hell, and every time we try to cooperate with them in any way they backstab us and then blame us. What exactly are we losing standing up to them when they're going to punch us whether or not we do?

I am starting to feel like you could just switch a few words around and then the shit we believe about them and the shit they believe about is identical

The concept is assymetry. The most obvious (Godwinian) example is to take virtually any anti-Nazi quote and intersperse the word "Jew". All of a sudden it becomes horrible and bigoted. You can absolutely then take any anti-Jew bigotry and say the word "Nazi", and it suddenly becomes just and true.

Why? Because Trump Supporters and Democrats ARE fundamentally different. The best answer to the paradox of tolerance says that tolerance is a social contract - we are to be tolerant to those others who accept to follow that contract, but it can be open season (in terms of intolerance, not violence) for those who do not.

[–] the_post_of_tom_joad@sh.itjust.works 0 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Why? Because Trump Supporters and Democrats ARE fundamentally different.

I don't think that's true, at all. I've been lucky enough to have some conversations with Trump voters and they have indeed said some dumb ass shit. But nothing unexpected, they're all from fox n shit

After we get past the fox talking points and bullshit we are the same.

[–] abraxas@sh.itjust.works 2 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I’ve been lucky enough to have some conversations with Trump voters and they have indeed said some dumb ass shit. But nothing unexpected, they’re all from fox n shit

Sure, in a few cases. In others, it was more on the tune of:

"I voted for Trump because he's going to raise taxes on the poor so they pay their fair share"

"I voted for Trump because he promised to get rid of illegal immigrants. Just because there aren't many in my state doesn't mean they're not CRIMINALS who should be removed at all costs!"

"I voted for Trump because he's going to do some crazy stuff like leave the Paris Climate Agreement. This is going to be fucking entertaining and I'll have my popcorn. People are gonna get PISSSSSED"

"I really don't like Trump, but no politician is perfect and I'm willing to deal with Trump because he's going to help us finally ban abortion".

Need I keep going? I blame them all.

[–] the_post_of_tom_joad@sh.itjust.works 1 points 10 months ago* (last edited 10 months ago) (1 children)

No, but you do need to take a deep breath, because you're talking a lot more than you're saying in anger.

Dont be angry at me for telling you this, that's not why I'm saying it. I'm saying it because i believe that anger is causing you to lose your objectivity.

And please, take one more breath if you're planning another diatribe... the whole point of my initial comment, to say we "shouldnt give in to the urge to dehumanize our opponents". Isnt an invitation for you to demonstrate precisely what i just said not to do.

[–] abraxas@sh.itjust.works 3 points 10 months ago (1 children)

I'm not angry right now. I'm just telling it like it is to me.

Please be careful not to think you read emotions into comments when they might not be there.

[–] the_post_of_tom_joad@sh.itjust.works 1 points 10 months ago (1 children)

Please be careful not to think you read emotions into comments when they might not be there.

Alright, i read you wrong, i apologize

[–] abraxas@sh.itjust.works 3 points 10 months ago

It's ok. It's so common that companies teach classes on interpreting (or not over-interpreting) emotion into email. It's one of multiple reasons people often get into heated arguments on the interrnet when they would not in person.