this post was submitted on 20 Feb 2024
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Will the real JC please stand up. (midwest.social)
submitted 9 months ago by Lanky_Pomegranate530@midwest.social to c/atheistmemes@lemmy.world
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[–] Liz@midwest.social 4 points 9 months ago (1 children)

Jesus almost certainly claimed that he and his twelve disciples were going to rule over the new kingdom of God (more or less a new era of the world in which suffering didn't exist). We can be pretty sure because Judas then goes and betrays him, which we're also very certain actually happened. No one has any idea why Judas flipped on Jesus, but we're pretty dang certain he did. In any case, if Jesus really were everything people claimed about him later on, he wouldn't have said all 12 of his disciples were going to be glorified in the next world.

Furthermore, we can be pretty certain John the Baptist really did baptize Jesus. My understanding of why is a bit more limited but basically that action put John in a higher position of authority than Jesus which would have been a big issue. Scholars think Jesus was originally a disciple of John.

Finally, Jesus probably actually was from Nazareth, because that town was basically like being from nowhere in those days. It would be strange to invent a story about a god and have them come from a podunk place, especially in those days where class mobility didn't exist.

I'll be honest though, if you're going to come at me expecting a deep discussion, we've pretty much reached the limit of everything I know. I'm a very casual learner in this area.

[–] afraid_of_zombies@lemmy.world 0 points 9 months ago

Jesus almost certainly claimed that he and his twelve disciples were going to rule over the new kingdom of God

Prove it.

We can be pretty sure because Judas then goes and betrays him, which we’re also very certain actually happened.

Prove it. Also explain why Paul doesn't seem to know about it.

Finally, Jesus probably actually was from Nazareth, because that town was basically like being from nowhere in those days. It would be strange to invent a story about a god and have them come from a podunk place, especially in those days where class mobility didn’t exist.

Not if you held to a doctrine that "the last shall be first and the first shall be last". A very popular theme in Jewish mysticism. Plus it would explain why there is no Jesus family around to claim the throne, except for James.

Furthermore, we can be pretty certain John the Baptist really did baptize Jesus. My understanding of why is a bit more limited but basically that action put John in a higher position of authority than Jesus which would have been a big issue. Scholars think Jesus was originally a disciple of John.

Criteria of embarrassment is the term you are looking for. That thing almost never used outside of biblical studies since it is a weak argument. It doesn't work here. John the Baptist was more well known than Jesus was at the time of Mark. By attaching Jesus to him it was just another form of name dropping. Additionally Mark has John still humbled in the role. So even less embarrassing for Christianity.