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Legend has it we still don’t know (lemmy.world)

submitted 9 months ago by nifty@lemmy.world to c/whitepeopletwitter@sh.itjust.works

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[–] irmoz@reddthat.com 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

No, social democracy is absolutely a leftist ideology, it just asserts that socialism can be achieved gradually, using capitalism to improve things in the near-term.

Again with the incorrect bullshit. That's not social democracy. That's democratic socialism. And even that is yet another misnomer - a red herring of controlled opposition, intended to preserve capitalism by placating the masses with bread and circuses.

Stop using capitalist propaganda to define socialism. You will only continue to embarrass yourself.

Also, pointing out that "socialism" and "socialist" are different words is not rejecting the dictionary. It's sticking to it.

I'm done allowing you to occupy any more of my time.

Read.

[–] sugar_in_your_tea@sh.itjust.works 1 points 9 months ago (1 children)

That’s not social democracy. That’s democratic socialism

No, democratic socialism believes capitalism is incompatible with their core values, so they wouldn't tolerate as much of a gradualist approach. Social democracy is the gradualist approach, though whether that ends up as socialism or stays a some form of welfare state can vary across parties and individuals. So:

democratic socialism - socialism plus democracy
social democracy - democratic welfare state, with many supporting a gradual shift toward socialism

Read

Perhaps you should do the same.

I've tried to be very careful with the terminology I've used, and tried to make it very clear where the lines are. Your comments, on the other hand, seem to conflate terminology (leftist and socialist, for example) with no attempt to point me at actual sources to indicate where I was imprecise or wrong.

Regardless, we're going in circles at this point, so I agree, there's not much point to further discussion. I feel I have made my points pretty clearly with examples.

Have a fantastic day. :)

[–] irmoz@reddthat.com 1 points 9 months ago* (last edited 9 months ago)

democratic socialism - socialism plus democracy

Nope, democratic socialism is trying to vote your way to socialism, somehow reaching socialism through liberal democracy. Alas, socialism is opposed to liberalism. Democratic socialism is a nonsense, fictitious political platform.

Socialism is already inherently democratic - perhaps fanatically democratic. "Socialism plus democracy" is as redundant as "sandwich plus bread".