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submitted 11 months ago by furzegulo@lemmy.dbzer0.com to c/linux@lemmy.ml

US politics has been pretty fascist lately. The state is filling up concentration camps, engaging in mass state violence against people on the basis of racialized traits, deporting them to random countries without any respect for habeas corpus, exerting state pressure on the free press to censor speech critical of the current administration, and Trump is openly floating the idea of an unconstitutional third term.

Fascism is clearly on the rise, and they’re winning more and more power. None of this is far removed from us in the FOSS community – there are a number of fascists working in FOSS, same as the rest of society. I don’t call them fascists baselessly – someone who speaks out in support of and expresses solidarity with fascists, or who uses fascists dog-whistles or promotes fascist ideology and talking points, or boosts fascist conspiracy theories – well, they’re a fascist.

If one consistently speaks in support of a certain political position and against the opponents of that position then it is correct to identify them with this political position. Facts, as it were, don’t care about feelings, namely the feelings that get hurt when someone is called a fascist. Fascists naturally do not want to be identified as such and will reject the label, but we shouldn’t take their word for it. People should be much more afraid of being called out as fascist than they are afraid of calling someone a fascist. If someone doesn’t want to be called a fascist, they shouldn’t act like one.

It’s in this disturbing political context that I saw an odd post from the Cloudflare blog pop up in my circles this week: Supporting the future of the open web: Cloudflare is sponsoring Ladybird and Omarchy. Based on Ladybird’s sponsorship terms we can assume that these projects received on the order of $100,000 USD from Cloudflare. I find this odd for a few reasons, in particular because one thing that I know these two projects have in common is that they are both run by fascists.

Even at face value this is an unusual pair of projects to fund. I’m all for FOSS projects getting funded, of course, and I won’t complain about a project’s funding on the solitary basis that it’s an odd choice. I will point out that these are odd choices, though, especially Omarchy...

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Instead of 3 full paragraphs of stuff everybody already knows, why not start by explaining why you think Ladybird and Omarchy are”run by fascists”?

[-] exu@feditown.com 29 points 11 months ago

That's explained in the blog post just below where OP stopped quoting

[-] lime@feddit.nu 18 points 11 months ago

it's in the blog post

[-] HouseWolf@pawb.social 10 points 11 months ago

Only thing I know about Ladybird is the lead dev didn't want to include gender neutral wording in the documentation, because he "didn't want it to be political"

That's kinda old news now and not sure if anything came of it.

[-] cabbage@piefed.social 19 points 11 months ago

He now also celebrates Charlie Kirk hoping that others will pick up his great work, and whines about white men being discriminated against in tech.

Let's just say he's certainly not anti fascist.

[-] HouseWolf@pawb.social 3 points 11 months ago

Oh lovely...

[-] majster@lemmy.zip 13 points 11 months ago

A new online crusade. Once again heavy accusations with very weak supportive evidence. It became a pattern already.

[-] avidamoeba@lemmy.ca 9 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)
[-] arcterus@piefed.blahaj.zone 4 points 11 months ago

To be clear, he's not the founder of Ruby, he's the founder of Rails.

[-] avidamoeba@lemmy.ca 3 points 11 months ago

Fixed. Thanks!

[-] Rentlar@lemmy.ca 6 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

If we want to use the Nazi bar analogy, Cloudflare is like a company that bought up so many bars in town that some end up not vetting for Nazism well enough, letting it slip through, not necessarily playing favours towards or against fascism but they would technically be a 'Nazi bar' under the analogy's definition. Cloudflare is so big that they probably don't have controlling interest about the pet projects they kick some pennies towards.

If you want to boycot Cloudflare itself, that's fine and noble and all, but also staying away from anything they've ever donated to, you'll put yourself in a bind. Like if Cloudflare donated to animal welfare, should one be against animal welfare simply due to second-order links to fascism?

Also there is a lot of reading into the comments used to link the two projects to the fascist regime. Very much a stretch.

[-] avidamoeba@lemmy.ca 2 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

Check this. Bit more than a comment. Wouldn't call it nazi. But sus nontheless. We've seen plenty people write or say similar stuff over the years that graduated to fash later on.

But yeah agreed about CF. I take this kinda info more as a mental note on the individuals. CF is a corpo which is gonna corpo.

[-] ronigami@lemmy.world 6 points 11 months ago

Calling Kling fascist is insane

[-] cabbage@piefed.social 13 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

At the very least, someone celebrating Charlie Kirk and whining about white men being discriminated against is not someone I'm interested in supporting, and if the future of the open web is in their hands I'll just stick to lynx.

[-] ronigami@lemmy.world 0 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

The good news is that ladybird is nowhere even close to implementing the full web. It’s maybe 0.5% there. There’s no danger of it becoming some centralized power at least in the next 5 years. Especially barring any license shenanigans.

As for Lynx, well it’s really hard to take that comment seriously.

[-] cabbage@piefed.social 2 points 11 months ago

More seriously from a technical side, I'm also not a huge fan of the browser and the engine being the same thing. To me they should be kept separate. So personally I'm cheering on Servo.

[-] lime@feddit.nu 5 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

i will continue to say that kling is just a pretty offline guy, and also very much unaware/uninterested in america. most people around me are saying the same things about the kirk shooting and i would not consider them even close to what americans would probably call "centrists", but here is called "right-wingers". people here had just never heard of him or any of his opinions before last week.

kilng strikes me as a man who has never had politics happen to him before he started working in open source, and he is being treated like he shares american values and american cultural knowledge just because he speaks english online.

i don't agree with his stances at all, but it's the norm where he and i live. "åsiktskorridoren" was a political punching bag for a reason.

[-] YaBoyMax@programming.dev 18 points 11 months ago

Interpreting a PR which changes "he" to "they" as pushing political ideology is not an apolitical stance. I don't know a ton about him and I'm not convinced this makes him a "fascist" by association, but the fact that he seems to be ideologically aligned with the ones in power on America is troubling at the very least.

[-] lime@feddit.nu 11 points 11 months ago

so i've talked about that event at length before and i don't have the time to dig up my old comments right now but the short version is

  1. sweden has a weird history with gendered pronouns in that our english language higher education recommended using male pronouns up until very recently, and the language itself just recently got a gender-neutral one which still isn't in general use.
  2. the documentation was rewritten to use second-person pronouns (and a much friendlier tone) shortly after, sidestepping the entire discussion.
[-] the_abecedarian@piefed.social 11 points 11 months ago

He commented directly on the Charlie Kirk situation. If he jumps in, he will have to deal with people's reactions

[-] lime@feddit.nu 2 points 11 months ago

right, by saying "nobody deserves to die for their opinions", which is what most tv pundits are saying.

[-] avidamoeba@lemmy.ca 10 points 11 months ago* (last edited 11 months ago)

RIP Charlie Kirk

I hope many more debate nerds carry on his quest to engage young people with words, not fists.

This implies Kirk was a debate nerd. He wasn't. He was a prolific propagandist with a vast, well-funded operation. He pretended to debate here or there in-between monologues of fascist propaganda. TV pundits aren't the people who you want to look up to as bearers of objectivity on the matter, given they're threatened with being taken off the air. It's no accident they talk about the person but don't talk about what he said or wrote. Maybe Kling is mislead by them. Maybe not.

[-] lime@feddit.nu 10 points 11 months ago

i'm not talking about american pundits.

the media here has never shown any kirk debate, and has only talked about him as a "american right-wing debater/influencer". personally i was aware of him only as that too, and only saw how heinous his opinions actually were when i googled him after the event. and i, along with most other swedes, have a fairly high regard for our public broadcasting institutions, and since most american internal squabbles don't influence us until they become external, we don't really care to dig deeper. i did because i'm active here, but kling probably didn't.

[-] avidamoeba@lemmy.ca 7 points 11 months ago

That does make sense.

[-] stsquad@lemmy.ml 1 points 11 months ago

I didn't know who Kirk was until the assassination I have better things to do with my limited time than go on a deep dive into their history before posting any comment on the news. I kinda got the vibe when I realised that was who Cartman was based on in the recent South Park.

[-] 0_o7@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 11 months ago

Wow. Some people really think we're in the 80s and rely on "media here" to deflect from being mislabeled.

He's somehow so far away from US politics he's funded almost exclusively by US companies like Cloudflare, FUTO, and 37signals.

Does your media or public broadcasting talk about FUTO and 37signals a lot that they got in contact to setup sponsorship? Doesn't he also stream in "English" on "YouTube"catering to the English speaking world but somehow he shielded himself with all the crap from these platforms. He must not be a human.

Even a cursory skimming of kirks name would be enough to reveal what his quest was.

But this defense is fucking weak. Try harder.

[-] TMP_NKcYUEoM7kXg4qYe@lemmy.world 1 points 11 months ago

just because you are active in some internet circle, does not mean you are active in every internet circle. I'd say the Right to Repair movement or Cloudflare are more "worldwide" than Kirk.

[-] Auli@lemmy.ca 2 points 11 months ago

I've barely heard of him before he was shot. And all I knew of him was he had debates with people. Not everyone is tied into American politics.

[-] the_abecedarian@piefed.social 2 points 11 months ago

Kirk wanted ppl to die for their race, gender, and other things that weren't even opinions. While Kling's statement is technically fair, he didn't speak out for anyone else. Why weigh in on a white supremacist, transphobe who made many ppls' lives worse?

[-] Auli@lemmy.ca 2 points 11 months ago

Speak out for who else? Who else has been killed that makes international news. And no your daily school shootings do not make international news.

[-] the_abecedarian@piefed.social 5 points 11 months ago

This is a silly argument. There are killings that make international news. There are killings that make Swedish news. He doesn't comment on any of them, only when a far right agitator dies in America is it suddenly important to him.

[-] lime@feddit.nu 1 points 11 months ago

there's no way for me to answer that

[-] kami@lemmy.dbzer0.com 8 points 11 months ago

An "offline guy" who develops a web browser.

Is this comedy, funny coincidence or purely bad faith?

[-] lime@feddit.nu 3 points 11 months ago

the guy is an ex-drug abuser. he started doing serenityos as therapy, and serenityos needed a browser. until you get to the modern stuff, it's basically just a paint-by-numbers api implementation on top of his existing code base.

[-] 0_o7@lemmy.dbzer0.com 0 points 11 months ago

You missed that he was a WebKit developer for god damn Apple.

https://2025.stateofthebrowser.com/speaker/andreas-kling/

What's with all this apparent obliviousness to paint him as a rags to fame personality?

[-] lime@feddit.nu 1 points 11 months ago

i never said he was destitute or self-taught. you need skills to be an os dev. the first few paragraphs there is what i based my post on.

this post was submitted on 24 Sep 2025
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