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We don’t just need electric cars, we need fewer cars (www.greenpeace.org)
submitted 3 weeks ago by PapaSkwat@lemmy.today to c/fuck_cars@lemmy.ml
32 comments fedilink hide all child comments

Interesting article from 2018. But nothing has changed at all. Even the electric cars I see on the road are huge.

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[-] jtrek@startrek.website 25 points 3 weeks ago

Yes. I've been saying for years that electric cars and self driving cars are solving the wrong problem. The problem is if I need a car to get groceries. The problem is I'm not safe on the street because of all the cars.

People who have never lived someplace that doesn't need a car are very eager to tell you how it won't work, though.

[-] njordomir@lemmy.world 3 points 3 weeks ago

The roads here are so wide (usually 6 lanes plus turn lanes and a median) that we could build wall2wall apartments/condos/flats on on half of the road and still have enough road left for 3-4 lanes of traffic and a detached dedicated bike path and sidewalks.

Cars take up way more space than people realize.

[-] Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 6 days ago

streets like these really make you feel it in your bones, everything feels comfortable and spacious with like 500 people on the same street until 5 cars show up and suddenly there's a fucking traffic jam out of nowhere.

[-] scrubbles@poptalk.scrubbles.tech 16 points 3 weeks ago

As an electric car owner, I completely agree. We were lucky enough to go from 2 cars to 1, but still not enough transit to go to zero

[-] CaptainKoerk@startrek.website 15 points 3 weeks ago

Public Transport for the win!

[-] PapaSkwat@lemmy.today 6 points 3 weeks ago

I wish we had it in my area!

[-] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 1 points 3 weeks ago

Public transport is awesome for cities but for rural areas it doesn't suffice

[-] thanksforreading@lemmy.ml 16 points 3 weeks ago

OK but most people live in cities so we can just fix that problem first.

[-] Mongostein@lemmy.ca 12 points 3 weeks ago

Don’t you know? You have to fix every problem all at once or you shouldn’t even try. It’s the same reason we shouldn’t bother with renewables.

/s

[-] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 4 points 3 weeks ago

Yes that's true but the focus should really be on mass implementing it in cities and not on trying to force it on rural areas.

Public transport is awesome for high density population areas but a bus with 4 people in it might as well have been a car.

[-] CaptainKoerk@startrek.website 3 points 3 weeks ago

I life in a rural area, I use public transport.

[-] theuniqueone@lemmy.dbzer0.com 3 points 3 weeks ago

Except it does. It's not "cost effective" but can still be done.

[-] geneva_convenience@lemmy.ml 2 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Ebikes and/or electric cars are a much better solution for rural areas.

[-] theuniqueone@lemmy.dbzer0.com 2 points 3 weeks ago

Disagree strongly

[-] tunetardis@piefed.ca 10 points 3 weeks ago

I got tired of waiting for EVs to become affordable and got an e-bike instead. I still drive at times when the bike doesn't cut it for various reasons. And now my car is getting super old and in need of replacement, but I'm not sure what to do?

EVs sound ideal, but the usual logic that the higher upfront cost will come back to you in fuel savings feels less compelling in my situation. Otoh another gas guzzler? One thing I can say is I don't see myself ever buying new again. It's just not worth it for how little I drive. I guess I'll leave EV/hybrid/conventional debate up to what's available on the used market.

[-] pdqcp@lemmy.dbzer0.com 6 points 3 weeks ago

If you barely use your car, you might not even need it anymore. Perhaps a taxi/rental/car pooling might meet the few times you still take it out of the garage? Specially when you put the numbers down and see how expensive it is to maintain a car

[-] tunetardis@piefed.ca 6 points 3 weeks ago

You have a point. My brother gets by fine now without owning his own wheels. And my grownup kids don't even have drivers licences.

I guess where my situation differs is that they live in big cities compared to me with all sorts of options for getting around. Also, I'm a part-time musician with a lot of gear I have to transport to gigs, particularly if I'm running sound.

[-] PanArab@lemmy.ml 4 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Would you consider something like the Bestune Pony to be affordable? It retails for the equivalent of 8000 euros after 15% VAT. I am seeing it more and more and I live in a place where petrol is 0.50 euro a liter.

[-] tunetardis@piefed.ca 3 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

Well my wife is certainly fawning over it when I showed her photos!

So unfortunately in North America, there is a 100% tariff on Chinese EVs which, oddly enough, predates Trump. In Canada specifically, they are easing this somewhat so that 49,000 will be allowed in every year before the tariff kicks in. (That number apparently reflects EV sales before the tariff was implemented.)

But yes, I would definitely consider something like that if I could actually find one here.

[-] PapaSkwat@lemmy.today 1 points 3 weeks ago

I wish we had those here in the US!

[-] tangentism@beehaw.org 10 points 3 weeks ago

Of course, because EVs do not address the problem and just do a misdirection.

The problem is publicly subsidised private vehicles.

[-] desmosthenes@lemmy.world 8 points 3 weeks ago

more trains and busses

[-] PapaSkwat@lemmy.today 4 points 3 weeks ago* (last edited 3 weeks ago)

When I was growing up, I was a sci-fi nerd. I loved the idea of cool little electric cars. But the ones I'm seeing around here are huge. We're also learning that even electric cars are fucking up the environment.

What I didn't imagine is electric bikes and scooters. So that's been a cool thing (I have both), but it has downsides too.

I volunteer at a local hospital, and we've seen a huge uptick of injuries from people riding electric scooters and bikes. The reason is that more people are on them, but our infrastructure in my city doesn't support them very well. So people are having to ride on busted sidewalks, roads with no bike lane, etc. So a lot of people crashing them (and not wearing a helmet).

So I think the only we can really reduce car usage is to make the city unfriendly to cars. But that ain't gonna happen here anytime soon. A strip of road near me actually was finally updated with a pretty wide bike lane last month because it's close to a school, but holy shit, people in my neighborhood are still bitching about how we didn't need it and it was a waste of resources. smh

[-] Greyghoster@aussie.zone 3 points 3 weeks ago

The big problem with this transition is not whether we need fewer cars but that modern cities are not designed for alternatives. Any near term solution has to include EVs. It’s going to take a large redesign and investment at a time we can’t wait while we need to electrify everything.

[-] AnUnusualRelic@lemmy.world 7 points 3 weeks ago

Modern US cities.

[-] Greyghoster@aussie.zone 3 points 3 weeks ago

Modern Australian cities too.

[-] Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 2 points 1 week ago* (last edited 1 week ago)

ironically australia is generally a great example of how easily american cities could unfuck themselves by just running trains on the railways they already have and building apartments near the train stations.

Like yeah brisbane isn't a paradise by any stretch, but remarkably it's not an endless hellscape of highways and single family houses! You can get a train to the airport! There's an actual downtown rather than a sea of parking lots with 7 shops!

[-] Greyghoster@aussie.zone 1 points 6 days ago

It’s the suburban sprawl that is driving the car based transport. Suburbs are established further away with no proper infrastructure, shops and facilities. Cars are the only way to get about as everything is so hard to get to. Extending freeways to them doesn’t help as the commute time is lowest in a car.

[-] Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

~~But 1) apartments don't tend to be built in suburban sprawl, and 2) even the worst suburban sprawl in europe is still generally bikeable, there'll be a lidl or something within a reasonable distance.~~

Got this thread mixed up with another, similar one. Ignore this reply lol.

[-] Greyghoster@aussie.zone 1 points 6 days ago

I was passing through the back blocks of Sydney, new suburbs that are a long way from anywhere. If you want to go anywhere it’s by car.

Infill of the inner areas especially around railways is happening which is great but the sprawl continues.

[-] Swedneck@discuss.tchncs.de 1 points 6 days ago* (last edited 6 days ago)

~~but are poor people really living in the suburban sprawl? I'm not debating whether the sprawl forces you to drive, my point is that suburbs are for rich people.~~

i just realized this is not the thread i thought it was, whoops

this post was submitted on 08 Aug 2026
143 points (91.8% liked)

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