It does nothing for the market for stolen firearms, because they were always being sold to criminals anyway, and laws only affect people who obey laws in the first place.

Where do illegally use firearms come from presently, though? My impression was that it's already really hard to smuggle them through customs. Although they can be stolen it's a hell of a lot easier to get them legally, and for a licensed owner simply to sell them (and no clear way to trace out back to that person) without caring who gets them or how they're used. Black market trading would continue for as long as there are still lots of illegal guns out there, but that won't continue forever if there aren't sufficient sources for new stock. Also once someone's found to have illegally sold weapons registered to them, it's unlikely they'd keep their licence for future legal purchases.

Are legal owners specifically worried that increased scarcity of guns in criminal groups, once they can't get them through more legit sources like a dodgy licensed owner, means there will be orders of magnitude stronger incentives for gun-wanting criminals to track down and steal their guns?

[–] bloop 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago) (1 children)

Where do illegally use firearms come from presently, though? My impression was that it's already really hard to smuggle them through customs.

I don't claim to know the answer to that for sure, given that I don't deal in illegal firearms:) But I have my suspicions.

I'm sure that some have come from licensed people doing deals with criminals for whatever reason. In 240,000 licensed people I'm sure there are a few dodgy ones, it would be naive to pretend otherwise. But organised crime in NZ mostly means gangs. We're talking about people who seem to be able to import and distribute vast quantities of meth; last time I checked, Customs weren't very fond of that either but they seem to get it through. We're a small country with a large coastline, and there are a lot of boats coming and going.

It seems to me that the firearms that are commonly available in NZ are both expensive, and not really what your average gangster is probably looking for, especially now that semi-automatic actions are illegal. I would imagine that if you're already in the underground importing business, getting a few handguns or military-pattern rifles tucked in with a shipment probably isn't too hard.

Are legal owners specifically worried that increased scarcity of guns in criminal groups, once they can't get them through more legit sources like a dodgy licensed owner, means there will be orders of magnitude stronger incentives for gun-wanting criminals to track down and steal their guns?

No, I don't think so. I mean, I'm sure some people think that, and there is some concern about poor data security leading to the whole database ending up in the wrong hands and becoming a "shopping list" for criminal gangs. But I don't think that's the majority of the reason for most people.

(Edit: formatting)

[–] gibberish_driftwood 2 points 1 year ago* (last edited 1 year ago)

if you’re already in the underground importing business, getting a few handguns or military-pattern rifles tucked in with a shipment probably isn’t too hard.

Maybe but that's something I think I'd be keen to seek more info on.

My impression is that drug imports are cost effective because you can typically sell a tiny volume for a vast amount of money, making up for the risks. The equivalent volume in guns would perhaps be possible to smuggle in, but also make them extremely expensive compared with alternative non-smuggling options. Especially if you risk Police confiscating all guns found in or around your possession as soon as you're caught using one of them, and you can't just get your mate with the licence to go out and buy you replacements. If that were the case, at least, there would be very few internationally smuggled guns circulating.

(Edit: typo)