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I'm all for universal health care. But at the same time being outdoors/hiking/fishing most of my life.
Some of the insanely stupid shit I've seen people do in the middle of fucking no where...
I mean accidents happen, but if you're that idiot that ignored four warnings and got gored trying to pet a bison, part of me thinks you SHOULD have to pay for that helicopter ride
People are just ok with this. It's so bizarre.
I mean... damn, the US is not a real place
Only in America.
Works the same in Germany :/.
He was a nurse to. Which just makes him more aware of how things like that can just ruin a person in the us. Remember when that hospital took away healthcare benefits from its janitorial staff. That to me is peak us explanations. A hospital can't afford to give its staff health insurance. ugh.
In Switzerland I pay 40CHF (~49USD) yearly to get a free helicopter evacuation in case of an accident. Never needed it, but I know people that have. Absolutely worth it. While it's "just hiking" in most cases, being out in nature in the middle of nowhere can get dangerous fast.
I don’t think people on here realize this but America literally has this too. My grandmother pays for it because she lives out in a very rural area. She pays a little more ($79 a year)
Not bullshitting you: https://www.lifeteam.net/membership
Quite limited service area: https://www.lifeteam.net/services/service-area
True but there is more than one of these orgs in America. This one just happens to be the biggest one.
joey lawrence here. i play the dimwitted heartthrob on blossom but there's no heart in the american medical system--last week i paid 5000000 to remove an entire package of sweet tarts from my urethra.
whoa!
In Italy I pay 0€ to be evacuated from anywhere. It's crazy that you have to pay for an emergency.
Yeah it's not great. Transport costs for emergencies are often only covered 50% in Switzerland. We do have the second most costly system after the US, and it's for the same reason imho, private insurers. There are some more guardrails here than in the US, so it's not completely horrible, but there are lots of better systems around Europe.
Regarding helicopter rescue specifically, that's kind of a funny case. In Switzerland the first helicopter rescue organization was founded as a non-profit foundation called Rega, and it continues to operate that way.
For patrons the Rega eats the cost of a rescue that no insurance covers. If you are not a patron and get rescued then the cost of the rescue that isn't covered falls to you. So in effect a Rega patronage also acts as a sort of gap-insurance.
Around 40% of the population are registered patrons of the Rega foundation. The cost for that is what benjirenji was actually referring to.
In Switzerland they deal with an endless line of brain-dead tourists that put themselves into stupid situations where helicopter evacuation is the only option, so I can kinda understand that they'd put some stuff in place to prevent people from abusing that.
Tourists are human and all humans deserve free and ready access to healthcare or other emergency services, regardless of if they were born within the arbitrary bounds of your nation or otherwise.
There is no understanding that justifies requiring payment for emergency services behind a paywall.
I once went on a trip to Atacama and as a responsible person got insurgence that specifically covered rescue above 5000m. When I got there locals told me that there are actually no rescue teams there or anything.
I once went on a trip to Atacama and as a responsible person got insurgence that specifically covered rescue above 5000m. When I got there locals told me that there are actually no rescue teams there or anything.
Not sure i would trust insurgents with that task...
I would fix it but they no one will know what are you taking about.
I will, but my memory is shit
The American healthcare system...
Not that gruesome but don't try that at home. Call an Uber.
Ok, the headline leaves out the little detail that the hiker is a trained nurse, which was able to self-assess that if he wasn't dying already, that he has been fucking lucky with the path through the body.
But in every other civilized country they wouldn't have to be able to self-assess something like that, they would call emergency services instead of gambling with the possibility that some nicked artery or a wounded organ gets worse because of the trek - especially the path out on the lower back just screams "kidney injury" or "danger to the blood supply of that kidney".
I know a lot of nurses and I've been an EMT for getting close to 20 years.
The self assessment was "I can breathe. I can walk. I can not afford a $30,000 helicopter ride"
Yeah, i figured as much. Long term damage did not enter the calculation when faced with financial annihilation.
It’s interesting they mention paying for a helicopter. Not sure how that works both in the US and in other “civilized” countries.
But I suppose tax paying people need to decide on how to deploy emergency services. One could say if you take on the risk of climbing a 12,000 foot mountain, then you should be responsible for paying for your rescue. (Btw the article doesn’t directly quote him as saying he didn’t want to pay. Also there are other factors like you are then endangering the lives of the rescuers and possibly other hikers by bringing in a helicopter in such terrain.) Of course then there are people who would say if society doesn’t cover the cost of such a rescue, then only the wealthy will be able to “go on such adventures” or “do stupid shit” depending on your take on the activity. (See for example climbing Mt Everest.)
So it was an interesting choice of the author to put that “pay for” phrase in there. Meanwhile people who get cancer through no fault of their own also cannot get treatment they can’t afford.
But anyway yeah that dude is lucky he is a nurse.
I live in Austria, we have our fair share of mountains. If it is a medical emergency like in this case, you won't get a bill. If you get surprised by a sudden weather swing that wasn't forseeable, you won't get a bill. If you are a stupid tourist wearing flipflops and getting lost in the dark on the mountaintop, you will have to pay. So personal responsibility is still there, but only as far as it could be expected from someone trekking onto a mountain.
I wish everywhere was this reasonable.
Those fucking poles are overpriced outfitter gear. He'd have probably been better off with a good stick.
You mean with a stick impaled on his side? How is that better? (The stick may or may not be clean)
What are you? A rep with big shitty aluminum walking pole?
Let's just assume I was speaking to the other grizzled sorts that can evaluate a walking stick that their grandchildren can use without fear of unintended impalement.